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Young people don't come with an instruction manual! Tracy Kimberg spoke to Paola Royal to figure out the secret to raising mentally healthy and resilient children. Paola can be fond at https://www.healthylivingwithpaolaroyal.co.uk/ For help with any issues raised in this podcast, or for a free initial consultation, contact Tracy: Facebook: www.facebook.com/Tracy.Kimberg.Counselling.Therapy.Coaching/ Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tracy-kimberg-9564a3193/ Instagram: www.instagram.com/tracy_kimberg_hypnotherapist/ Website: www.tracykimberg.com My name is Tracy Kimberg and I'm a counseling hypnotherapists practitioner and teenage therapist, but I'm also a mother of three amazing daughters. You know what I've often wondered how helpful it would have been. If they'd handed me. An instruction manual when my child was born so that I just would know whatever I have to do. Just follow the manual and guaranteed. I will be a perfect parent. Everything will go fine, but no, this is not how it works in real life. Parenting changes day by day, curve balls get thrown at me and my child unexpectedly. And to make it even more complicated, each child is uniquely different and reacts differently to exactly the same thing. But this is all perfectly normal. So what are the basics of raising mentally healthy and resilient children? I invited my dear friend Palo Royal to discuss this with me so we could figure out together what is the secret I'm a Towner, um, out a year ago, I think maybe a little bit less than a year. And Paula has an incredible understanding about, um, how you can be okay with whatever's going on around you and not get overwhelmed. And I think, um, with teenagers and with children, it's very overwhelming to experience any type of emotion. Um, and sometimes, um, I think we make the mistake of actually teaching children that it's not good to feel angry. It's not good to feel. Um, annoyed. It's not good to feel your emotions. You have to be happy. You have to be positive. You have to, you have to not be negative. And, um, I don't think that's very helpful for children specifically. What do you think? What you, you just pointed it out. You know, we get overwhelmed, you know, so we get overwhelmed with our child and we get overwhelmed with the situation. And, uh, they're, it's, it's really, really interesting to see that actually our children, when they get born, they are perfect. They're perfect human beings. And then through, um, people, circumstances and events, um, there start changing and we are all, um, brought up to be conditioned to think that outside circumstances are responsible for the way we feel. Hmm. And also we'll be looking for the answers from the outside and, um, that is what our children, the same thing. So now when we can see, or we can be, be, can start to pick up the child where it needs to be picked up, but not putting on the child, what we think, how the child should be. So for example, I'm taking an example for my son, um, And normally I, I was brought up, you know, to thank you, go to school and then afterwards to do an education and then you have the job and it's all wonderful. And then you can let go of that child. Um, but my son also, um, didn't want it to go into education. So he was in school and then afterwards he, uh, went to college. And then he worked in holiday for my husband, and then he decided actually, I don't really want to continue with education. I had enough, I have enough of occupation and he was just turning 18. And, uh, I just want to work for the moment and. I could hear my little me coming up saying, Hmm. But it should do really an education. First of all, you know, before he goes out in the big wide world and starts working, but that was not my son. And he had a very good idea. So, um, we, we looked at it from all angles and we all thought, you know, he did music technology in college and Exeter and we all thought, wow, that's really fun. You know? So let's, you know, let's, let's. Get him done. Um, but he didn't want to do it. Wasn't for him. And then I clearly saw with this understanding, knowing how my experience is created, I did clearly see that it is something I wanted my son to be, but that wasn't, my son is perfect and he is resilient, you know? And. He got everything he needs in him and I it's for me to hold him to how to spec. I think I explained it the other day, we were talking about it before we started to do that podcast. And I explained it like a flower when we have a child, it is we, we, we have a seed which is in the earth and we need to nourish it. We need to look after it. But we can't do the growing for that child. We can't do the growing of that plant. The growing that plant is doing itself. And we don't know if that bland turns up with, well, we know around the color, but not exactly the color it's going to have. We don't know how many pedals it's going to have and it's on us. To nourish it and to hold it, maybe when there's a wind coming, you know, to hold its back to hold its sight. He knows that it's not falling over in the wind, but the growing. That child is doing himself. Right. So true. You know, um, it's very difficult. Um, I think the hard part about parenting is when your child is going through a difficult time, because you really feel their pain and, um, that, um, is, is hard too. Um, But you want to maybe fix it. You want to figure out what can I fix? What can I do to change it? You want to have an action. That's going to fix this problem. Um, but a lot of the times, or your child's needs in those moments is just your support. Like you say, your, you being there, being able to sit there with them, listen to them and allow them to feel whatever they feeling without judgment. Um, you know, um, but it's not always easy as a twin. You see your child upset. You often end up in tears as well. It's, it's very difficult, but that's, uh, that's what we need to practice is just allowing yourself to, um, be the support system and helping them to find solutions to, um, helping them explore different options that are suitable for them. Because like you say, you're not your child, your child's not you. And you might think a solution. That would work for you, which not necessarily would work for your child. It's difficult. Mm, it is, and it can be very, very hard and, um, it can be very tearful for us. It can be very frustrating for us parents, um, very much so. And that's okay as well. But when we understand how our moment, moment experience is creating that we live in a thought created reality. So it's not my child who makes me. Said of Australia is my thinking about that child, because I want to save that child. And when I can see that, then I can sit in that sadness and be okay with it and embrace my sadness because I know it's. Thought creating this reality. And I know it's passing through me like the clouds in the sky passing by, and I can sit in that sadness and they can cry my eyes out and I don't have to change it because I know my experience is going to change on its own. It's going to be something different in the next moment. But then when I know that, then there's nothing for me to do nothing to change. I don't have to change their child, but I can hold it back because I know then like you just ride the set as well. I can not think like my child and my child pin or think like me, you know, we are completely different. Um, identities. But what connects us is our unconditional love with that child is, has nothing to do what I personally think how the child should live their life, but to love that child, however it should. So if we could only create a world where, um, All human beings could live unconditionally in a love bubble. It would be such a lovely world. And, you know, I think I see children in my practice that, you know, their self-worth and their self value is so low. And, you know, it's not only external factors from parents that affect them like that. Um, you know, our job as parents is to try and help children. To be resilient. Yes. The world, the word of the century probably is resilience, but, um, to help them understand that, um, their thoughts are what creates the emotions in that moment. And I, you know, I think we underestimate the intelligence of children, even young children. How do you think, um, for the mom, the dad or people that are heavily young children, how do you think you can help a young child understand that? They emotions are created by thought. Hmm. Well, they actually, in-between a few books out there. Uh, one I actually wanted to send to you, uh, written by, uh, she not Oxo and I haven't sent it out yet. And, um, this explains really beautiful and really easy words. Um, how our moment to moment experience is created. And, uh, she did that with pictures. It's really. Really easy, easy read. And, uh, as a parent, you know, you can work through this book with your child. And, uh, I actually find that as younger, the person is, it's easier to actually understand them. So there's also a podcast we're just going to come out already. Yeah. Should be out already for a while, but it's going to come out where we interviewed one, uh, child, um, Sheena and I've interviewed, they had one child. Um, and the resilience said child has and how their child experiences understanding. And, um, yes. So it's talking about that. And so, um, there are ways it's very simple. Um, we're simple words. And, uh, I, for example, I was working once voluntarily in the way, MCA in Exeter, and it was talking to one of the young adults there and, um, He wanted to do some work with me. And, um, just said before we do that, let's have a look how your experience is created. And so we sat down together and we just worked on that and just, I just said, what do you think, where do your feelings are coming from? And he just said like this, and then at the other. And I just said, it's thought, thought in the moment. About an outside circumstance about something else. And he looked at me and he started laughing and I said, why are you laughing? And he just said, why nobody ever told me that. And it was so simple and he really straight away he got it. He just did understand it. It's because young people, they haven't got so much clutter they're carrying around through the life as, as we already have. And they don't make things complicated. They're, they're keep things really easy. And you know, when you explain it to them and you say like, look, you know, your experience is like a cloud in the sky. And, you know, that's moving along, you know, and then comes the next thing, you know, or you see like a thought bubble or, you know, uh, I explained it as well to one child. Like you sitting in this UFO. You know, UFO and you experienced life only out of this UFO, you know, and then, you know, we just started to play with that around, you know, that you can see it out of you UFO, and then your parents can see it out of bears and you know, and then you started it. So is there that loads of ways? So you can, yes. Now you can explain it how you can explain it in a very simple way. Mm. Yes. And I think, um, you know, um, there. It's it takes practice, um, for us as human beings, because we were brought up in a certain way. And, um, I often, I don't know if you find it, but often find myself repeating something that my mother used to say to my children, we've programmed. Um, and we can unprogrammed ourselves or reprogram ourselves and it takes practice, you know, um, I wouldn't say it needs practice. I just think, you know, when we have an insight, so like yesterday I had a client and she just suddenly said like, Oh no, it doesn't work that way. That's the little insight you get, you know, because what I'm talking about, what we're talking about here is about an understanding. It's a fundamental understanding how, you know, how we work, how, where, how, how our experience is created. So it's not. Uh, any technique, but an understanding it's like gravity, you know, there is a mathematical equation behind how gravity works, you know, and through knowing that we are able to build airplanes and they can fly. And that's the same with us human beings, you know? So when you have this understanding and you start to see. See that it's something which works insightful. So you have this aha moment. And when you start to see that you can't make that unseen, you know? And, um, so it's not really practice. I know what you mean with practice, but that's also something we think, you know, we need to learn and then we need to do it and it's repetitive and dirty, but it is something which just falls into place automatically. And we are required. Mm, you know, it's like when Europe start to build in you, it's like a new input comes in and then it builds in Europe will effect like a stone going in the water and it builds this ripples. And that's how it works as well. You know? So it comes in, builds a ripple, and then it goes on the next year and builds a ripple. And then it just starts to fall into place in a different way. it's actually amazing. And, um, you know, I see, um, with my children, you know, how just showing that acceptance and unconditional love, um, uh, through. You know, explaining to them that, you know, it's okay to feel, however you feel. It's okay to have these experiences that you are going through, how it calms him down. Um, it just brings calmness, um, by showing them that it's like you say your it's your thought created reality. They definitely laugh. That's an unconditional love come as all down. And I just think, you know, that's, that's what the kids really need, you know, to be there and then know they can trust us. And as soon as they can trust us, you know, that it's a completely different relationship. It's more inflow, isn't it then. But it's in flow. It's not always easy once again. Um, we know when, when you're, when something goes completely wrong and your child does something completely. Off the charts that's, um, that's difficult to handle and to not get angry and to not, you know, want to lose your cool, um, You know, I suppose once again, that's when you have to focus on your own reality, that your thought process is in and what, what are you thinking in that moment? Why are you getting so upset? That's one thing. And I just think it's a really important thing as a parent as well, too. When you start to understand how your mind works, you start to be less judgemental with yourself. You know, when you see they are all this parenting books, you know, and you get this parenting book out, you know, and it says X, Y, Z, you know, and then you try that out with your child. Like we all know, and it's not working, you know? So why is it working in that book? And it's not working with me and, Oh, I'm a terrible person. I'm a terrible parent, you know, I should know better. And you know, daddy, daddy, but. Actually, you know, we all doing every moment and your thing, you know, every moment is fresh for us, for our children. So returning as a parent, always new and fresh, and there is no recipe for parenting, you know, and we always, always give the best we can in every moment we don't know any different. So it can let ourselves off the hook in that moment. We don't know it any different, but when we can start to see that, I cannot think like you, and you cannot think like me and how my experience is created, that this child, my experience is not coming from the child, but from me what I'm thinking in the moment about that child. So my frustration I'm having. It's from thought. About this child, whatever it is, because probably I wanted to react in a different way, or maybe I want to do something completely different. And then the child turns up and wants something off me, but I actually busy with something else. And then I get frustrated and it escalates or whatever it can be, you know? But when I can see that for myself and I think especially now as well with them, the third lockdown and all this family's sitting at home together and you don't hardly get any spare time on your own as well. It can be, it can seem very, very hard. And then it's very important to, to know what's going on for me and look after myself, nourish myself, looking after myself. But I do know when the door opens and my child wants something for me, my reaction is not maybe then. Very nice because I want to do X, Y, Z. When I start to see that, I know I don't need to react this way. Uh, just less just lets everyone off the hook. Doesn't it? Yeah. It just lets everyone off the hook. And I think, um, it brings a lot of calmness and acceptance and love into the house. Hmm, when you say it's all about control and, uh, you know, letting go of that control, isn't it? We, so I don't know what it is about being human and control. We are human, human humanists, you know, that's what we do. We don't know what yeah. We want to control, um, everything that we lay our hands on, even our children, but I think. What the secret is, is, and the less you control your children, the more they are happy. And they're more you feel in control because what makes you feel out of control is when your child is unhappy. You think, Oh, I need to fix it. I need to, um, something's not right. What's going on? What can I do to fix it? I'm the mother, I'm the parent. I have to fix it. But you know, in letting yourself accept that this is just a thought created reality, and you need to let this whole thing, just take its process and pass through you. Your, um, your child gets calm because you are calm. They learn how to react in this exact same way. And it just brings calmness, doesn't it? Mm, absolutely. Absolutely. Um, yeah, and it's, it's a small, what comes up for me is. As well, giving responsibility to the child, you know? So when we, like you said assault before, you know, it, it's really important to start to, um, give this child responsibility what we often don't do. You know, we want to protect it from absolutely everything, but this child is resilient and has this resilience in it. And it is for us to point out, for example, danger. So for example, uh, um, another thing would happen to my child. Um, my first husband, he, um, was more the careful men and my husband. Now he's more the guy who likes to do dangerous sports and, and so on and so on. And we took him to, um, to Wales, into the Cory in North Wales. And we went in there and there are signs where it says dangerous, don't go there. And he was teaching thin that, you know, you can go there, but you need to take responsibility. So what we doing today in our society is that we don't even let our children go to. Different areas, you know, instead of explaining them, you know, you can go there, but you need to look out for X, Y, Z, that you know, that nothing happens that you take responsibility, that nothing happens to you, but you always take responsibility to the situation, you know, and we don't do that anymore. So it is really, um, And it's important for the child to learn, to be responsible. And it's actually thanking us indirectly for that. You know, they'd be trusting. And I think that's a very important point too. It is, or you're making me actually laugh inside because I, um, Um, I'm a rule breaker of nature. You know, I, I liked breaking rules because I like taking calculated risks. So I'm the one that, for instance, um, if there's a walk and it says danger, don't go here with a fence. I might even climb the fence because there's no danger. I always say, now I'm willing to face the consequences. Um, and yes, it is important because, um, you know, we live in a society where children are completely, um, my partner always says, brought up in cotton wool. Yeah. You know, and they can't experience things. Um, if I think how we were in, we were young, we were left to. Bicycle in the streets and do whatever we wanted to climb trees, go swimming the river without your parents. We just went crazy, doing anything we wanted, but the children nowadays aren't, they're not allowed. Um, And it's not only because we, as parents say, they're not allowed a society that says yeah. What is society? Society is as humans, but it is because as humans, we don't take responsibility anymore, you know? So when you climb over that fence, you know? Yeah. Why is it that they put the danger sign up is because they want to protect themselves because there are some people who don't take responsibility, you know, and then the claimant on the owner of that property, for example, or, um, they don't care for the environment, which is there. And that's the reason, you know, yes. Climb over that fence, but be responsible, be responsible to yourself and as well when something happens to you or to me in that case, you know, and it's my responsibility. I would never, you know, claim. You know, and say like, look, it's all your fault because you, whatever, you know, make a fence high enough, you know, the environment as well that we look out for nature, that we look out for the environment where we, which we entering in that moment. You know, I think it's really important that we take respect for that too. talking about, uh, taking responsibility, teaching your child to take responsibility. How do you think in today's times, do children learn consequences? Because I don't see, um, a lot of that. I think, um, children don't have consequences nowadays, if you don't because you learn responsibility because you have to learn, there's a consequence to every choice you make, there's a consequence or decisions to whatever you do, but children nowadays there's a Tuesday or no consequences. If you look how they can do whatever they like at school, that the teachers aren't allowed to, you know, punish or do anything, um, If a child, for instance, doesn't do their homework. There's no consequence. I think, um, I'm, I'm not sure about that. I mean, I know what you mean, you know, but, um, there are still somewhere consequences, you know, they're coming up somewhere in their life, you know? So I think, I wouldn't say consequences, but obstacles isn't there. So I mean, life happens, you know, and it happens to, to each and everyone in different ways and it shows up in different ways and. Um, so I wouldn't, I, I don't know. I think it, it comes the way it it's supposed to come in that way, you know? So, um, it's very difficult when we don't have, um, a certain case we talking in the moment, you know, so to, to talk about that, I find a bit. Yeah. Well, for instance, if you've, if you look, uh, for instance, uh, children drinking or using drugs, Okay. Um, there's a consequence that's against the law. So you can point go to jail or you can get into trouble with the police, or if you take drugs, um, the same as if you, um, drink under aged, you can get into trouble. You can't go to jail, but either your, your you're getting into trouble. There's a consequence. But, um, You see, I think a lot of the time, because of the way some parents overcompensate, because of, um, the way they were brought up in a society. That generation, where there was a huge consequence, you would get a hiding from your parents or you were expelled from school or something like that. In our days, if you did anything wrong, you got expelled from school or you got gated, you know, you weren't allowed to go out or you got, uh, hygiene. Um, a lot of parents nowadays do not have. Any, um, they going completely the opposite way and saying, well, if you want to take drugs, take drugs. If you want to drink, drink, if you want to, um, you know, stay out at night. I'd know for instance, that in this town where I live Dorchester, they are kids 14, 15 year old walking the streets at two, three o'clock in the morning and their parents know about it. It's dangerous. So they close their children in directly to very dangerous circumstances thinking, Oh, well, if, if they want to do it, they must do it. I don't either. I know me too. I mean, I, but that's my opinion, you know, so that parent probably sees it completely different and that's, that's where we see again, different realities, you know? So when I think maybe his ride is something completely different for you, you know? Um, so, but what I see is, again, this goes in for me to, to give responsibility to that child and talk it over. So for me personally, it was always very, very important to keep the conversation open with my son and, um, I think that was really good because for me, it was really important that he knows he can come to me with whatever is happening in his life. Um, so he can, he can come and he took and talk about it and he knows he's safe when he's talking about that. You know, so, but what I think is a child needs boundaries. And I think as a parent, you will. Indirectly set this boundaries. So the child is doing whatever. And you as a parent, um, say, I don't agree with this. You know, I don't agree with it, you know, in the end up from a certain age, like 40 and 50, and it's a bit tricky now to really get through with, you know, what you think, you know, should be done. Like I said, should be done what I think in my life, but it's something completely different for that child, but I can say, look, I don't agree with it, but give them the reason why as well. And then. Um, we say there are no consequences. I mean, for example, with Chuck's, there are consequences and the consequences are very clear, uh, and that is the health. You know, so that's the biggest consequence of all, you know, so you can really point out as a, as an adult, as a parent, as a teacher and whatever, you know, we need to educate our children. I think education is absolutely key in everything. How should they know when they're not educated? So no, they do know the risks and when they're still doing it, Look then in the end, it's there buddy. It's there. It's it's them. And I can only say, look, I'm not agreeing with you. I don't do it in front of me, but still for me, it's very important to keep that conversation open. And I'm convinced when we, as parents and adults keep the conversation open then and give responsibility to our children, then they actually don't even. In most cases, I can't speak for everything, everyone, but I just think in most cases then the, actually the child doesn't even go that far, that they get so far off the rail. I say now, Yeah, I think they're going through phases and children as well. They need to try the new and they need to do that experience, you know, and if you know, it's one thing when I tell them, I remember my parents say, you know, X, Y, Z to me. And, you know, I said, look, I have to go this my set of, through that myself. I need to do this experience myself. It's great that you're saying that and that you want to protect me from it. But look, here I am. And. You know, and, but I, me personally, I don't know about you. I always said my parents in the background, you know, when I was, my father was always saying, Oh, you spending your time with this dark people, dark, not dark in color, but you know, dark in, uh, They were from a background. My, my father didn't like, for example, you know, there's this dog person, you know, in dark, in not how can I say, I know what you mean. It's like kids, I don't want that color. It's not, it's like that. Um, How can you say that? Like the, um, the emo people, you know, the people were that Wade black and the eyeliner and, but people that are, do things against what your parents think, you know, that person, you know, it's like, Oh, you know, my, I headed in my background, you know, my father thinks, you know, my parents thinking, Hmm. I was sitting there with all this. They were friends of mine and I liked it, but somehow I thought, you know, is it really, you know, the right group of people on here? And I spent my time with some dodgy people when I was younger for a short time, you know? But on the other side, you know, they're all filled with NAF and now they're all coming from the same place. And I learned from it and I learned one thing today from it, like then for today. And that is that we are all the same. All the same and you know, what, through everything, what our children going through, there's learning involved. Hmm. Exactly. Every experience is a learning experience, stays in touch. Um, and that's what we need to remember. I think, um, it's about letting go of that control and allowing your child to experience their own life. And grow into their own person and love them for whoever they want to be and to whoever they want to become, you know? And. I don't know. Um, you know, I've, I I've had friends in the past that have said that they feel disappointed in their children. I'm a lucky parent. I've never felt my child is a disappointment. I I'm, I love my kids. They're also different and they're all unique in their own way. I love them to bits, but, um, I think there's nothing more hurtful than for your child to feel that they are a disappointment. Hmm. You know, no child deserves to feel disappointed. Um, like a disappointment. Yeah. It's interesting. It's uh, we can talk forever about this country. It's so interesting. Yeah. I just want to say something to that. I mean, when you think it's a disappointment, you know, what is a disappointment, you know, it is for you. It disappointment for you as a parent, a disappointment because you have beliefs around your knife, you know how your life is, you know, how your shot a child should be. Um, and, and w. That's that's what we reflecting then on that child. And then we start to see that it's ours, you know, and we take responsibility again, beg for what is ours, you know? And that, that has nothing to do with our child, that this child is. Is a new seed. We're just growing and it's its own identity, its own perfect human being, showing up in its own ways. You know, when we can start seeing that. So Paula, um, To kind of sum it up, um, in a couple of sentences, what would you say the key to emotional wellbeing is for children? The key for emotional. Well to understand mindset and to have loving, caring parents or foster parents or people around their child who is holding the child's bag to understand that child, to trust that child, to give responsibility and laugh. Laugh is most important. You know, it's not, we are not here to, we don't need to, uh, help someone, but we need to hold people's bags and the same with children, you know, and it is, you know, the love, the unconditional love that is that what connects us or. We all are love Andre. That's all made of as, like you said, right in the beginning, I think it was what you started with when you say it, that we were all born. Perfect. So, yeah. And we still are perfect perfectly. Individualized in our own unique way. Perfectly unperfect humanists. Yeah. If you could just take it with a little, little, um, Trimble of humanness and a little bit more fun and not take life so seriously, you know? Yeah. Thank you so, so much parlor for joining me. It's been a lovely experience and it was wonderful. I'll see you again soon. Yes. So I'm going to share, um, that, the name of that book in the notes. So please do send me that link. I'll add it in the notes for the great young children. Yeah, have a lovely day. Bye. Bye